Also I want to hear from you, is it ethical and why?
I am going to say that it’s unethical for someone to eat others or themselves, lab grown or not, because the community members in a society want to 1) curtail or reduce suffering and 2) increase ways to promote better judgment and impulse controls.
1 - We treat cattle and animals for food production with such contempt and disdain and cruelty, and if we were to start eating humans (lab grown, self-eating or otherwise) we’ll treat humans the same. Delegating some humans to be eaten, lab grown (by choice or not) or otherwise, is going to create a lot of societal strife and suffering. How does self-eating contribute to suffering? See reason 2.
2 - People who consume others or themselves cannot be guaranteed to be devoid of sociopathic characteristics. Even if someone is just eating themselves, it blurs the line between food source and community member.
I think it is the same as people who smoke or cut themselves to relieve stress—yes, whatever you’re doing is your choice and seemingly only affecting you. However, the second hand smoke/scarring in the case of the self-cannibal is their poor judgment and poor impulse control. We expect society members to exercise better judgment and impulse control because the way they think impacts everyone around them.
Why does self-cannibalism seem like poor judgment? Think again of someone who cuts themselves to relieve stress. The way you treat your yourself, including your body, is a reflection of your state of mind. Only a narcissist would say that they’re in complete control of their mind, including the subconscious part, and so their self-eating will be harmless and not result in any bad behavior towards others, ever. We already know vegetarians have more empathy than meat eaters: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/animal-emotions/201207/brain-scans-show-vegetarians-more-empathic-omnivores
As mentioned, we have historically always treated animal sources of nutrition with disdain, contempt and cruelty. If someone feels that it’s okay for them to eat themselves using lab grown meat, I worry what kind of psychological interplay justifies that decision for them. Do they hate themselves? Is this self-harm? What will their interactions with other people be like after doing this?
So, yes autonomy and self-actualization is an inherent right of cognitively advanced beings. But they lose that right the second it starts impacting someone else’s self-actualization.
In short, even self-cannibalism is unethical because society wants members who are not sociopaths and who won’t contribute to the suffering of other members.
Ladies and gentlemen, it apprars we have a winner of the most braindead take award!
Stop brigading posts nifty
People will eat meat if they want to, you can’t stop them and at the end of the day brigading annoys people and disrupts social media
It’s the exact same thing you and your group did on reddit
Just stop brigading posts and stop mass downvoting any posts that contain meat, I’ve looked at the vote ratios of posts in food subs enough to know that it is being done
What the fuck are you on about? I am only on lemmy, and don’t use any other boards.
You’re the one lying about me and brigading.
Maybe you’re a stooge sent by big-Cannibalism to help make this tech popular? See, I can make baseless claims too 🙄
This is exactly what I tell people who want to drink their own cum. Like, how can society trust you, man.
How is this any way self-harm? To be clear we aren’t talking about growing a whole person here as you seem to be confused. We are talking about a few cells in a petri dish or vat. This is all just psychobabble nonsense. You’re the one here who shouldn’t be in polite society.
How can you qualify that it’s not self harm? Maybe we need to do brain scan study of what it looks like for people who cut themselves vs those who eat meat grown from their cells.
Because it doesn’t physically harm me to do so. Cutting yourself is physically painful and damaging to your body. Growing cells in a pitri dish to save on dinner is neither of those things.
Self harm isn’t just physical though, https://www.healthline.com/health/emotional-self-harm
Okay now you’ve really lost me? How in the hell is that emotional self harm? If anything I’d take it as a self-compliment that I taste good :p
So, if self-cannibalism of lab grown meat is allowed, then cannibalism of lab grown meat (so cells from other people) would also be allowed.
Think of how we treat other sources of animal derived foods, it’s pretty shitty and cruel treatment. In this case, the person chooses to eat self sourced or other person sourced lab grown meat because eating a real person would be murder, and cutting themselves up would be physical self harm.
The question is what is the underlying psychological justification for them deciding to eat lab grown human meat. Is it that they’re avoiding physical pain and murder? Lab grown animal meat is there to substitute for animal meat. But what’s the justification for lab grown human meat? Novelty? Taste? Psychological issues? How do we trust this persons judgement for themselves and others?
The issue is that human societies veered away from cannibalism for social issues, and so how do we trust those people who would engage in some form of cannibalism, even if it’s their own lab grown cells.
Some context which also gives European views on first encounters and how the social revulsion to this idea was established https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/making-of-an-imperial-polity/cannibalism-and-the-politics-of-bloodshed/D4D05AE81BBADD074FBCDC09504605D3
I fail to see how we treat meat animals as relevant. No ones going to be caged and mistreated because there’s no reason to.
The fact your eating human meat isn’t enough to cause psychological issues when no one was harmed, and the idea that it does is fucking laughable.
Unless someone is actually mistreated, which again no practical reason to, as getting a microscopic sample to grow from is harmless. Where would this psychological damage come from? Because it would remind us of the animals we did kill and eat? That’s fucking goofy. The psychological harm of cannibalism IS FROM THE PHYSICAL HARM BEING DONE TO THE OTHER PERSON. NOTHING ELSE. THATS IT.
Eating something that harmlessly grew from my body isn’t going to impose psychological damage, nor does it imply I lack empathy for myself or those around me.
There’s ethically no difference between eating your own lab grown meat, and eating your own boogers. There’s ethically no difference between someone eating your own lab grown meat, and someone eating your boogers.
It doesn’t automatically put me in the same class as livestock. I’m not undermining my humanity, nor does it mean I don’t care for myself. Your hang ups are your own. Get the fuck over yourself.
This almost reminds me of the weird psychosexual hangups incels have but for vegans. Imposing meaning where there is none, Jesus fucking Christ dude.
I mean you have to buy it on your own accord, culture your own cells, and then successfully cook and eat them. As long as you aren’t stealing other people’s cells to eat them without their consent it seems more ethical than the current meat industry.
But it’s still cannibalism, yeah? If someone consented to be eaten before they died or even wished for it, would you be OK with eating them?
This is unironically one of my favourite questions to ask new friends. I’ve gotten a variety of answers, but my own response has always been yes, if the person was healthy and had clearly consented.
In my opinion, cannibalism is bad for two main reasons, 1) it can be unsafe if the person was ill, the meat has spoiled, or if it’s done too often (this has been studied in cannibalistic rituals) and 2) it’s unethical if the person doesn’t consent to it.
Eating animal meat is non consensual and there can be diseases in there too - many people have died from it. Just because it’s more socially acceptable, I don’t really see it as an ethically better decision.
I would 100% at least try my own home grown meat cells.
Damn, I love your response, even though I don’t know of I agree! Are you Vegan?
I personally see it as No, because I see us humans as special. Speaking as an atheist, end of day, we are special as humans.
I eat meat, I try to limit it to the ethically harvested. Hunted, family farm grown, it even tastes the best, any concerns aside. But eating a person is WRONG, consent or no.
I’m not vegan or vegetarian anymore because I have a lot of allergies that prevent me from eating plant based anything. But I also try to limit it to locally and ethically harvested when I do eat meat.
I identify as agnostic and definitely don’t believe that any one living being is better or more special than the others (except maybe cats).
Why is it wrong though? And why/how are people special? You didn’t provide any reasoning to either.
It’s interesting that you ask if they are vegan, as if understanding the ethical problems of eating meat would only be valid if you are also strictly vegan.
You evidently understand it is not completely ethically correct to eat animals in all circumstances, as you say you only eat ethically harvested meat. But you also say you believe humans to be special as a reason to eat animals, so why not eat all animals under all circumstances?
The main point though, why would it still be wrong to eat human meat if lab grown and consensual?
If you’re eating yourself I think it’s autophagy
We have to draw some sort of line here though. Will this give you prions? Does this end the person’s life like traditional cannibalism usually does? Theres a lot to unpack in these tiny man steaks. I’d still rather people be growing their own meat at home in a petri dish than having animals locked in cages for eternity.
In the current hypothetical:
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It’s screened, you can’t legally sell prion meat
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It’s taken nonlethally as a sample from a consenting human, possibly you
Ethical
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So, if it were the original cells, then it would be autocannibalism, since these are cloned cells (from what I gather) it’s technically not the same thing. [Edit: Personally, it’s a bit of a tossup in my mind. I don’t think it’s unethical, but it’s still a weird thing]
Yeah, I’m also unsure how I feel about it, I asked because it’s such a strange thing to think about
would you be OK with eating them
are they yummy ?
Haven’t tried it, you’ll have to make your own judgement there!
stealing other people’s cells to eat them
This will become a sex thing for sure
There’s a (pretty great) movie where cannibalism is treated as a substitute for sex. It’s called Aamis.
I made a post about that a while ago: https://feddit.uk/post/14228639
Streets ahead
Well if they combine that with 3D printed cell scaffolds they can eventually make a flesh fleshlight out of their own cells
The time is coming for the most involved “go fuck yourself” ever.
3D printed cell scaffolds combined with this mean you can shape them
Now I wonder if someone has actually tried making a dildo from cultured flesh and skin
As long as you aren’t stealing other people’s cells to eat them without their consent it seems more ethical than the current meat industry.
Even if you did, while super weird as long as you didn’t get the cells through violence it’s probably still more ethical than the meat industry.
You can probably use some violence and still come out ahead. I don’t know how to do that math though.
And what if you don’t own a Honda?
The perfect gift for RimWorld players.
Hush, its so imperfect, it only makes meat, not Cowboy Hats made out of Cowboys
Is this considered vegan meat?
As vegan as it gets, I’d wager. You need to take an initial sample to cultivate the meat from, which obviously isn’t vegan, but to my knowledge, the rest doesn’t require any further samples
Likely depends on what’s needed/used as feed
Yes is it, as no animal is harmed:
“Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals.”Can’t speak for this specific kit but in general: A big problem with lab grown meat and cell tissue culture is that to grow cells in vitro you usually need fetal calf serum. That’s a liquid from, well, cow abortions basically, that contains a plethora of different molecules like growth factors and mediators. As far as I know, there is no vegan alternative to this yet. We are talking about a liquid here whose composition is really complex, so it’s a really big task to create a plant based FCS alternative that performs just as well.
Tldr: probably the set contains a liquid made from cows.
What about this post has anything to do with vеgаnism BudgetBandit
Anyone who thinks this is okay can suck my lab grown dick
Careful. Might create a fetish here.
You don’t wanna eat your own lab grown asshole?
If you don’t eat your meat, how can you have any pudding?
So what do we feed the cells to allow them to grow?
the process still relies on fetal bovine serum (FBS) as a protein-rich growth supplement for animal cell cultures.
FBS, which costs around £300 to £700 per litre
That’s a fancy serum made from cow blood
Also this all comes from a submission to an art museum in 2020, it’s not supposed to be an actual product it’s more of a proof of concept type of thing.
Right, I assumed we weren’t about to see this on shelves or anything like that any time soon. But man that could do a lot for animal ethics
Is this technically cannibalism?
This is by definition cannibalism
Full self cannibalism. Like consuming ones own various fluids
No, ethically more like chopping off a leg for dinner than eating boogers.
*growing a leg from boogers
I mean you could also culture booger cells
Could make booger candy
It’s worse, so much worse even though it shouldn’t be
That could be useful at night during hayfever season
And eating people is useful during nofoodbigstarve season, but is it right though?
This is fine. I probably taste good.
What if I want to grow my steak into a hollow-cylinder shape, and also, not eat it, per-se?
hummm delicious cancer meet
without causing harm to animals
- Humans are animals
- Growing me-steak and eating it causes psychic damage
- Therefore, an animal was harmed
If we cultured cells from someone with an autocannibalism fetish, would it then be OK?
Like I take 1d4 psychic damage whenever I see furries at cons, but I don’t think they should have to be banned
Just don’t get psychic damage, skill issue ngl
I don’t think you can generalize that. I’d love to have little me-steaks and I’d even share them with friends, especially if they can be a Möbius strip.
As long as the human chooses to grow their me-steaks themselves I see no issue.
Yes. You consented. It’s just more you.
I already have enough of me to go around.
Sounds like you don’t need to eat for a while then.
Non-issue or skill issue. Pick your poison.
I’ll pick not being a dick to strangers online, thanks.
Also I want to hear from you, is it ethical and why?
I don’t see why not. It hurts nobody, except maybe yourself. Not sure what the nutrition is on this thing.
Would any of you care to taste my meat?
Fuck, I’ve always wanted to eat human meat anyway. I’d kill for a sample like this. I don’t care about morals here. I’m a vegetarian. I just want to know. If my buddy was like “ayy we’re eating Dan from accounting’s arm tonight” I’d be there with no questions asked. The police can sort it out.
I’d kill for a sample like this.
oh boy do I have something to tell you
I don’t want to eat human meat, but I don’t mind if you kill that asshole from accounting.
Fun fact : Human meat is an excellent source of protein 🤓
You can eat placenta, if you really want to eat human.
I mean, if you’d kill for that you don’t need the kit.
Thats what im thinking- i rarely eat meat but how could i pass up ethical long pig? Im too curious
