Every time people lament changes to the lore that amount to “not every member of species X is irredeemably evil” and claim the game is removing villains from it, I think how villains of so-caleld evil species fall into two cathegories: a) bland and boring and b)have something else, unrelated to their species going on for them, that makes them interesting.

  • ProfessorOwl_PhD [any]@hexbear.net
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    3 months ago

    I’d argue Devils, by their nature of being lawful as well as evil, are often interesting villains because of their “species”, but it’s kinda different when it’s a creature literally made from the primordial essence of Evil rather than just a bad dude.

    • tamagotchicowboy [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      3 months ago

      I’d love to be literal devil’s advocate here and argue devils just think different, in ways usually not immediately beneficial to in-universe society but ultimately a plus by instead providing a stress test for development of what is in universe considered ‘good’. Insert the quote from Legend what is light without dark.

      • ProfessorOwl_PhD [any]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        Understandable - I prefer lovecraftian and fey creatures for alien thought processes, and use devils more as a foil/mirror to the lawful god of cities, merchants, and wealth, whomst I hate and will take any opportunity to drag.

        • tamagotchicowboy [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          3 months ago

          Always interpreted planar creatures as having an alien thought process in general. That is a good use of devils ngl, for related playing pallies/clerics with ‘my higher power is the people’ is quite fun.

        • Attaxalotl@ttrpg.network
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          3 months ago

          I see Fey not as alien, but as capricious. They do what they please, when they please, damn the consequences.

          They might commit arson against a local noble and then give that noble’s kid a super fancy cake; and not have a reason for either beyond “lol, lmao”

    • SSJMarx@lemm.ee
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      3 months ago

      the primordial essence of Evil

      See, I hate that this exists at all. I would much prefer alignments be tied to outlooks on life or even political philosophies than just baking deterministic morality into the setting.

      • ProfessorOwl_PhD [any]@hexbear.net
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        3 months ago

        No, equating alignment and morality makes them both meaningless. Morality should be tied to outlooks/philosophies etc, a personal matter of how the individual acts in a situation, while alignment with the forces of good/evil/law/chaos should be a matter of absolute determinism. It’s easy to look at D&D and say it’s wrong, but just because something’s bad in D&D doesn’t mean the idea itself is bad.

        • Attaxalotl@ttrpg.network
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          3 months ago

          I have it to where the good/evil extraplanar creatures are created as expressions of the good and evil within everything sentient.

          • ProfessorOwl_PhD [any]@hexbear.net
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            3 months ago

            Yes, exactly - as I put it to my players, a “person” isn’t able to be inherently good or evil. They’ll have their own morals - particular things they always will or won’t do - but alignment is for things literally made of the concept of that alignment.

      • dragonshouter@ttrpg.network
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        3 months ago

        Not all are made from one guy though. Some are just pulped evil in a can. Even with different outlooks on life there are still things that everyone would hate. Like “very specific crimes” to an infant. I say that’s enough for pure evil